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FrederickSebastian

Less is not always more...

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I read recently on one of the threads (though I cannot find it now) that CR may not work better if you eat drastically less calories. Is this true? In other words, CR works but extreme CR, in fact, does the opposite. I saw a documentary on people following CR and there was a woman on there who weighed like 115lbs and was 5'6" and ate 1300 calories per day which is close to where I want to be. Is eating 1,200 calories per day healthy for someone like me who is only 5'2". Will I wither away to nothing or can I maintain a BMI over 20 whilst eating 1200 calories per day? Opinions? Research?

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what I would suggest practicing in your case, is a more gradual scheme like the following example:

  • start with 1750 kCal per day, for six months, and check your body weight, If it is not increasing, go on
  • Then go down to 1500 kCals per day, as above check your bodyweight, go on for 6 months even if it stabilizes
  • Then, if your bodyweight stabilized above your ideal weight (let's say, a BMI of 19 or 20 kg/m2), then next:
  • Go down to 1250 kcal and follow again the above procedure.
  • Repeat the above cycles until your weight stabilizes at the ideal BMI (probably 20). Most probably, you should not go lower than this figure of 1250 kCAL, even though you are not tall.

It is a long procedure, but patience pays off, in all things, and risks are lowered.  A possible risk when doing things in a hurry is that bodyweight homeostasis adjusts itself to very low energy and you don't lose weight.

 

Edited by mccoy

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I think Mccoy's suggestion is good but you might do better to not just track body weight but also track other markers of health and fitness.  For example using a tape measure or skin fold calipers one can get an estimate of change in body fat helping one know if weight loss is fat or muscle.  Tracking physical performance such as how far you jump, how fast you run or how much weight you lift can be helpful too.  Or just take a weekly photo in a consistent pose and lighting and tweak your regimen based on what you think of the changes you see.

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On 10/19/2019 at 11:27 AM, Todd Allen said:

I think Mccoy's suggestion is good but you might do better to not just track body weight but also track other markers of health and fitness.  For example using a tape measure or skin fold calipers one can get an estimate of change in body fat helping one know if weight loss is fat or muscle.  Tracking physical performance such as how far you jump, how fast you run or how much weight you lift can be helpful too.  Or just take a weekly photo in a consistent pose and lighting and tweak your regimen based on what you think of the changes you see.

Ok McCoy thanks I also just started fasting for a month for weight loss and started a new thread that maybe you could help on... I will keep in mind what you wrote here...

 

Thanks for your time.

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I just finished a three day water only fast. When I say water only I mean really only water, no vitamins or anything. I used to do five day fasts but got very dizzy (and actually fainted twice).

Greger's video today makes me think I really shouldn't be doing fasts this way and should be taking vitamins and maybe some kind of electrolyte/salt replacement. I enjoy fasting but might enjoy it more without the lightheadedness and overall flu-like feeling I get by the fifth day.

Will your month long fast be medically supervised? Maybe it should be. I don't think I'm going to do any more fasting without consulting a doctor first.

 

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3 hours ago, mccoy said:

Thomas, was that hypoglycemia in your previous fast?

I'm not sure. It might have been, but it could have been something else too (electrolytes, salts, etc)

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On 11/4/2019 at 6:09 PM, Thomas G said:

I just finished a three day water only fast. When I say water only I mean really only water, no vitamins or anything. I used to do five day fasts but got very dizzy (and actually fainted twice).

Greger's video today makes me think I really shouldn't be doing fasts this way and should be taking vitamins and maybe some kind of electrolyte/salt replacement. I enjoy fasting but might enjoy it more without the lightheadedness and overall flu-like feeling I get by the fifth day.

Will your month long fast be medically supervised? Maybe it should be. I don't think I'm going to do any more fasting without consulting a doctor first.

 

 

Thomas--

 

To answer your question -- no I am not going to be medically supervised but yes I am an experienced faster. I have fasted over 50 times varying from 1 day to 20 and did not feel any different at all on the 20 day fast. Everyone's different I guess!

 

I am going to continue on my 30-day fast and let you know how it goes... I am currently on day 3 and feel great. If I feel sick I'll stop...

 

Thanks for your concern! and for the video!

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@Thomas G... I have finally gotten around to watching the first half of the video. Scary stuff! I am currently off the fast as I had a surprise birthday party with cake and decided to give in and enjoy... I am going to be much more careful about fasting and how long I do it from now on!


What is your opinion on the following link, when you get around to looking at it: 

This woman did three separate back-to-back 40-day fasts and says that her faith in God kept her going. It's funny to watch a video like you have posted, then see the 99% positive comments on this woman's youtube page, congratulating her for her faith in God and adherence to the diet...

 

I've decided to take it slow with the weight loss thing but really want to get in a 20-day fast once per year as I have done it before and nothing bad happened. I am very nervous about doing now learning that so many people died suddenly and unexpectedly after fasting in the video you posted. I have also read about the world's longest fast, where a man went 382 days without food losing hundreds of pounds. It makes me wonder: what makes some people successful on these fasts and some people reach death? I have gotten SO much feedback both negative and positive from fasters and septics that I just don't know what to do.

Needless to say, it'll be a good 6 months before I decide to fast again, and if I do, I'll be sure to include a multivitamin, electrolytes, calcium and magnesium as recommended by so many experienced fasters. On another note, I am a member of a fasting group on facebook with over 40,000 members and have seen people do fasts as long as 40 days and get this: no-one on there (that I know of) has come close to death yet.

I tend to be on the cautious side though. I want to try fasting again in 6 months, starting with a four day fast and gradually moving onto a 20-day fast. If I am successful enough, one of my dreams has been to fast from June 20, 2020-July 20, 2020. As I have said before, many people on the fasting group I'm a member of have done 40-day fasts safely. I think six months of research and questioning with doctors should help. If, by June of 2020 I feel like I will be safe to fast, I will go ahead and give it a try, listening closely to my body along the way. If I feel sick at any point I will quit. I am not willing to sacrifice my health for some stupid fast.

Thanks for the video! Certainly made me think twice! If I decide to fast in the future, I will do it after a great deal of research and great caution, listening to my body as closely as I can every day.

Let me know what you think about the woman who did the 120 day fast!

 

Fred 😉

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I skimmed a lot of these videos (but didn't watch every second of every one).

Did she have medical supervision? She never said explicitly, but I get the impression that she didn't.

I've always wanted to do a 40 day fast. Given how badly short fasts of just five days go for me it seems like maybe it's not in the cards for me, or if it is, I will need to be drinking something special to stay healthy.

Her focus seems almost exclusively religious (with maybe some weight loss ambitions thrown in too), but given that refeeding seems to be the most important part of a fast her matza only refeeding diet seems like a particularly poor one from a health perspective. I wouldn't do it. I'd be breaking a long fast like this with modest amounts of nuts and berries, some fruit and dark greens (but not too much).

I admire the endurance and the willpower, but I don't think this is the way I want to fast.

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6 hours ago, Thomas G said:

I've always wanted to do a 40 day fast. Given how badly short fasts of just five days go for me it seems like maybe it's not in the cards for me, or if it is, I will need to be drinking something special to stay healthy.

If you have some genetic impairments in the gluconeogenesis pathway, you may need to drink diluted fruit juice, like Valter Longo underlines in his book on the FMD.

Alternatively, you may need to drink electrolites for the same reasons.

The reactions to pure water fasting appear to exhibit a wild variability, as everything else in human biology and metabolism.

I would have loved to do a long fast, but after 5-days I gave it up, I simply wasn't able to do anything, not physically nor mentally. For those who tolerate it, water fasting may be a formidable way to boost purification, regeneration and so on. For the less tolerant ones, like myself, Longo's FMD is a very viable substitute which can be repaeated regularly with little concerns. Also, a keto-variant closer to the pure water fast may be tried out.

Another safe way would be, for those who have the money and time, to go to specialized fasting clinics. 

Refeeding is of vital importance, probably even more important than the fast itself. Right amounts of food (very little usually at the start of refeeding) and right nourishment (progressively nutrient-dense with lots of hi-quality proteins) are a must.

Edited by mccoy

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