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mccoy

glucose versus cholesterol optimization

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On 8/29/2021 at 12:45 AM, Ron Put said:

and I couldn't resist this personal tale 🙂

Why I Quit The Keto Diet

Interesting anecdotal story from Drew Harrisberg. Please note that he has T1D which means his pancreas beta cells are completely nonfunctional and that he must use exogenous insulin otherwise he's toast. He agrees that a keto diet very high on animal saturated fats blunted his insulin receptors. He agrees that keto diet can be done on vegetable food although it's not long-term sustainable.

It's an interesting fact that after turning to a healthy vegan diet his insulin receptors became very sensitive, even with high concentrations of carbs.

I don't know if all his conclusions are valid in individuals without T1D, but basically, he makes a point.

In my case, I am not cutting carbs very low and even that allowed my BG baseline to drop to normal. My next step could be to reintroduce gradually low GI carbs and decrease fats, although I don't find very practical a VLF diet.

What is sure is that my adiposity was lower on a lower fats diet than on a lower carbs-higher fats diet, since the former provided less calories. In my personal experience, low carbs and ad-lib energy did not yield rippedness and six-packs.

Edited by mccoy

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Keto diets are potent because they virtually eliminate carbs. The problem with carbs is fat! And the problem with fat is carbs. We have enormous data on low fat high carb diets (not junk food carbs)! But the keto diet is not in the same camp; however we do have the Inuit populations and they seemed to do ok eating largely carb free high fat diets that were whole food based. My hunch is a proper Keto diet may not be terrible and for some may indeed be healthful. The key of course is a proper whole food based and very low carb keto plan. I doubt many are doing that. For myself I’ll gladly continue with a whole food plant based low fat diet.

Edited by Mike41

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32 minutes ago, Mike41 said:

however we do have the Inuit populations and they seemed to do ok eating largely carb free high fat diets that were whole food based.

They seemed to be ok for the short lifespan they were allowed. And, probably, their evolutionary adaptation to such an extreme diet involved a brutal selection with so many Inuit bodies strewn along the ice. Only those with the right genetical polymorphism survived to procreate and the spawn would eventually carry such polymorphism. Or die prematurely.

This is the truth that the acolytes of the paleo religion fail to aknowledge.

Edited by mccoy

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Hi Mike41!

I like your diet.  I don't think much of keto diets -- except for the morbidly obese.  A keto diet helps fat people lose weight.  If they ever make it to CR, your type of diet is, IMO, best.

  --  Saul

 

 

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https://dmsjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13098-020-00580-w
 

combination of k2 and Vitamin D effects

Conclusion

Individual or combined supplementation with vitamins D3 and K2 significantly decreases the glucose levels and  % of functional pancreatic beta cells, while D3 and D3 + K2 treatments also induced a reduction in the uOC/cOC index. Only in the group with vitamin D3 supplementation, it was observed a reduction in undercarboxylated osteocalcin while vitamin K2 increased the carboxylated osteocalcin levels

Edited by Mike41

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23 hours ago, Saul said:

Hi Mike41!

I like your diet.  I don't think much of keto diets -- except for the morbidly obese.  A keto diet helps fat people lose weight.  If they ever make it to CR, your type of diet is, IMO, best.

  --  Saul

 

 

Thanks Saul I couldn’t have summed it up better!

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I've been following this moderate-carbs regime for over 3 months now. I renounced to all simple sugars like honey and brown sugars, to all cereals and starchy vegetables, eating sometimes half a peach in a day, sometimes modest amounts of legumes. My main source of carbs is lactose from fresh dairy products, mainly lowfat or nonfat. I'm eating vast amounts of vegetables and conspicuous quantities of nuts and seeds.

The result is that presently in the fasted state  I'm hovering in the BG range of  90-100 mg/dL. Not as good as I was expecting, but other conditions have changed, like now I cannot practice aerobic exercise because of important commitments, also I must eat hurriedly and cannot devote time to cooking or preparing food. I've lost 3 kg from my latest report, having now a BMI of 23.8, whereas previously it was 24.9. Adiposity has decreased a little, lean mass is about the same.

I believe the change to be significantly beneficial, considering the fact that this diet does not bring about spikes or transients in blood glucose. So, unless things change, the first step of the optimization seems to have been acceptably reached, now I'll have to worry about blood lipids. Next move will be to monitor the other variable, cholesterol and trigs. Didn't do that yet because I cannot do it that at home and need at least to go to the nearest pharmacy on an appointment, which is not easy presently.

Of course, there are possibly suboptimal aspects in this regime, like the largish amount of protein ingested and the sweeteners. I'd like to be so much a stoic as to avoid completely to indulge in the taste for sweets, but I'm not.

 

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5 hours ago, mccoy said:

My main source of carbs is lactose from fresh dairy products

I imagine that the vegetables are the main source of your carbohydrates.  And lactose does not give the bang that most simple sugars provide, I believe.

Seasonally speaking, the fruit pumpkin has less sugars than the vegetable carrots.

Edited by AlanPater

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Alan, in terms of net carbs lactose was more often than not the prevailing carb last summer (I consumed lots of yogurt and fresh dairy products). Now it may not be so, it also depends upon the type of vegetables, I'm not eating often carrots or pumpkins. I should resume tracking with cronometer to be sure now.

As you say, lactose does not give a significant glycemic peak, although the whey fraction in some dairy products (like milk and yogurt) does give rise to an insulin increase. In strained yogurts like Greek yogurt the casein fraction is prevalent and insulin secretion is less stimulated.

 

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At last, I was able to obtain a current lipid profile, after 4 months of a moderately low-carb diet. All units are in mg/dL

  • Total -C 173
  • HDL-C: 66
  • LDL-C: 95
  • Trigs: 58

I would say that the results are totally acceptable, although not glamorous (except the values of the trigs which are pretty low and suggest no insulin resistance). The theory according to which the main responsible for elevated cholesterol are saturated animal fats seems to hold true in my case. I'm eating copious amounts of fats, especially EVOO since I have access to one of the best products in the world, plus nuts and seeds, plus a moderate amount of animal fats in dairy products.

My current fasting glucose is in the range of 95 to 100 mg/dL, which is not at all glamorous, but I had to cease all aerobic activities in the last 2 months, and probably that contributed to an increase in 5 mg/dL. Looking forward to starting again walking and jogging.

From the above data, I may say that I reached a sufficient degree of glucose-Cholesterol optimization. The glucose baseline is below the prediabetic threshold and the regimen ensures a lack of significant peaks. The lipid profile is reasonable.

The experiment may go along with testing some supplements like berberine for glucose and red rice oil or amla for cholesterol (it seems to decrease LDL by 20 mg/dL in some cases).

What I miss more in this regime is not cereals, nor fruit, it's dark chestnut honey in my hot cacao in the morning.

Edited by mccoy

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6 hours ago, mccoy said:

Total -C 73

That can't be right.  173?   

Looks great overall.

Quote

The theory according to which the main responsible for elevated cholesterol are saturated animal fats seems to hold true in my case

Holds true for me as well.  When I radically  reduced my cheese intake and increased olive oil/nuts,  my TC/LDL  plummeted.  

I'm still consuming plenty of dark алтайский  honey!  For me, calorie control/ maintaining a 21-22 BMI is the key to glucose control.

Quote

red rice oil or amla for cholesterol

Bergamot extract (from Italy!) is something else you could look into.

Edited by Sibiriak

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Sibiriak, yes, TC is 173,  thanks for underlining the error, I had to edit text and erroneously deleted a number.

I lost about 10 pounds since when my fasting BG reached a peak of 106 mg/dL (from a BMI of 25.6 to a BMI of 23.8) but it seems that fewer calories plus carbs control are barely able to maintain the baseline below the prediabetic threshold. That is, carbs control did not make a dramatic difference, probably because of the elevated protein and fats. Since I'm all right with the present regime, I'll go on a little further, then I'll try what happens by reintroducing some carbs, checking the response with a CGM. Hopefully by then I'll be able to resume a regular aerobic activity, which indisputably helps.

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