Just curious, anyone have a plan, or preps for global pandemic?

[Gordo]

Sometimes the news on China is SO crazy I wonder if its legit or maybe anti-China propaganda?

 

But the economic data that even the CCP itself has been releasing seems to support the reports:

 

Youth unemployment rate is now 19.9% in China, the highest they have ever reported since they started measuring it in 2018 (covers those looking for work aged 16 to 24 including recent college grads, rate was less than 10% before the pandemic).

Edited September 14, 2022 by Gordo

[AlanPater]

17 hours ago, BrianA said:

Risk factor for developing Alzheimer's disease increases by 50-80% in older adults who caught COVID-19

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2022/09/220913140850.htm

A retrospective study; did their predisposition to getting dementia increase their infection potential?

Agreed that the infection can affect many organs, including the brain.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/omicron-immunity-canada-covid-19-infection-vaccines-1.6581745 suggests we may be getting more dementia if the original report pans out.

[mccoy]

7 hours ago, Gordo said:

Sometimes the news on China is SO crazy I wonder if its legit or maybe anti-China propaganda?

It makes me think that maybe they are more worried about the upcoming meeting of the Communist party...

Edited September 14, 2022 by mccoy

[BrianA]

9 hours ago, Gordo said:

Just one anecdote, but my (over 70) mother in law seems to have accelerated "mental decline" after contracting covid earlier this year.  She had pretty severe symptoms when she got covid but recovered quickly after getting molnupiravir (Merck's covid anti-viral drug).  The symptoms of mental decline = memory problems, inability to follow google maps, getting lost, inability to think of even common words to describe things when talking (for example could not come up with the word "steering wheel").  But we noticed some cognitive impairment even before she got covid, so there is no real proof covid made things worse vs. just the natural progression.

 

Wow, sorry to hear about that. You're right in a case like that it's hard to really pin it on something definitive. But my feeling is every little health insult that people go through tends to nudge things along in an accelerated aging direction. For example this year The Queen caught covid for the first time AFAIK, and then just a few months later she died. They said her case of covid was "mild", but who knows perhaps it accelerated her aging.

[BrianA]

Definitely looking forward to us eventually deploying a vaccine that generates better mucosal antibodies. The current injectable vaccines just don't cut it for this.

 

"It is tempting to think that a vaccine administered through the nose or mouth, where SARS-CoV-2 enters the body, could provoke a local immune response preventing infection at an earlier stage. Several vaccines in the form of a nasal spray are now being investigated in clinical trials with the hope of being able to reduce the spread of infection and thus reduce the risk of developing new virus variants."

 

Mucosal antibodies in the airways protect against omicron infection

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2022/09/220914180010.htm

[IgorF]

the topic is not so hot novadays but was already discovered and continued to be researched, seems the researchers are still convinced that bradykinin disregulation plays an important role in tough covid cases

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20220916/Lab-experiments-add-further-evidence-to-the-bradykinin-storm-theory-of-COVID-19e28099s-viral-pathogenesis.aspx

it is interesting that it is rather computational biology powered by modern research hardware, maybe not a hallmark in research but curious as a methodology

 

[Todd Allen]

Nice review of the covid debacle in Surgical Neurology International:

COVID UPDATE: What is the truth?

Quote

As you have seen, an unprecedented series of events have taken place within this system. Hospital administrators, for example, assumed the position of medical dictators, ordering doctors to follow protocols derived not from those having extensive experience in treating this virus, but rather from a medical bureaucracy that has never treated a single COVID-19 patient. The mandated use of respirators on ICU Covid-19 patients, for example, was imposed in all medical systems and dissenting physicians were rapidly removed from their positions as caregivers, despite their demonstration of markedly improved treatment methods. Further, doctors were told to use the drug remdesivir despite its proven toxicity, lack of effectiveness and high complication rate. They were told to use drugs that impaired respiration and mask every patient, despite the patient’s impaired breathing. In each case, those who refused to abuse their patients were removed from the hospital and even faced a loss of license—or worse.

For the first time in modern medical history, early medical treatment of these infected patients was ignored nationwide. Studies have shown that early medical treatment was saving 80% of higher number of these infected people when initiated by independent doctors.[43,44] Early treatment could have saved over 640,000 lives over the course of this “pandemic”. Despite the demonstration of the power of these early treatments, the forces controlling medical care continued this destructive policy.

Families were not allowed to see their loved ones, forcing these very sick individuals in the hospitals to face their deaths alone. To add insult to injury, funerals were limited to a few grieving family members, who were not allowed to even sit together. All the while large stores, such as Walmart and Cosco were allowed to operate with minimal restrictions. Nursing home patients were also not allowed to have family visitations, again being forced to die a lonely death. All the while, in a number of states, the most transparent being in New York state, infected elderly were purposefully transferred from hospitals into nursing homes, resulting in a very high death rates of these nursing home residents. At the beginning of this “pandemic” over 50% of all death were occurring in nursing homes.

Throughout this “pandemic” we have been fed an unending series of lies, distortions and disinformation by the media, the public health officials, medical bureaucracies (CDC, FDA and WHO) and medical associations. Physicians, scientists, and experts in infectious treatments who formed associations designed to develop more effective and safer treatments, were regularly demonized, harassed, shamed, humiliated, and experience a loss of licensure, loss of hospital privileges and, in at least one case, ordered to have a psychiatric examination.[2,65,71]

Anthony Fauci was given essentially absolute control of all forms of medical care during this event, including insisting that drugs he profited from be used by all treating physicians. He ordered the use of masks, despite at first laughing at the use of masks to filter a virus. Governors, mayors, and many businesses followed his orders without question.

The draconian measures being used, masking, lockdowns, testing of the uninfected, use of the inaccurate PCR test, social distancing, and contact tracing had been shown previously to be of little or no use during previous pandemics, yet all attempts to reject these methods were to no avail. Some states ignored these draconian orders and had either the same or fewer cases, as well as deaths, as the states with the most strictly enforced measures. Again, no amount of evidence or obvious demonstration along these lines had any effect on ending these socially destructive measures. Even when entire countries, such as Sweden, which avoided all these measures, demonstrated equal rates of infections and hospitalization as nations with the strictest, very draconian measures, no policy change by the controlling institutions occurred. No amount of evidence changed anything.

Experts in the psychology of destructive events, such as economic collapses, major disasters and previous pandemics demonstrated that draconian measures come with an enormous cost in the form of “deaths of despair” and in a dramatic increase in serious psychological disorders. The effects of these pandemic measures on children’s neurodevelopment is catastrophic and to a large extent irreversible.

Over time tens of thousands could die as a result of this damage. Even when these predictions began to appear, the controllers of this “pandemic” continued full steam ahead. Drastic increases in suicides, a rise in obesity, a rise in drug and alcohol use, a worsening of many health measures and a terrifying rise in psychiatric disorders, especially depression and anxiety, were ignored by the officials controlling this event.

We eventually learned that many of the deaths were a result of medical neglect. Individuals with chronic medical conditions, diabetes, cancer, cardiovascular disease, and neurological diseases were no longer being followed properly in their clinics and doctor’s offices. Non-emergency surgeries were put on hold. Many of these patients chose to die at home rather than risk going to the hospitals and many considered hospitals “death houses”.

Records of deaths have shown that there was a rise in deaths among those aged 75 and older, mostly explained by Covid-19 infections, but for those between the ages of 65 to 74, deaths had been increasing well before the pandemic onset.[69] Between ages of 18 and aged 65 years, records demonstrate a shocking hike in non-Covid-19 deaths. Some of these deaths were explained by a dramatic increase in drug-related deaths, some 20,000 more than 2019. Alcohol related deaths also increased substantially, and homicides increased almost 30% in the 18 to 65-year group.

The head of the insurance company OneAmerica stated that their data indicated that the death rate for individuals aged 18 to 64 had increased 40% over the pre-pandemic period.[21] Scott Davidson, the company’s CEO, stated that this represented the highest death rate in the history of insurance records, which does extensive data collections on death rates each year. Davidson also noted that this high of a death rate increase has never been seen in the history of death data collection. Previous catastrophes of monumental extent increased death rates no more than 10 percent, 40% is unprecedented.

Dr. Lindsay Weaver, Indiana’s chief medical officer, stated that hospitalizations in Indiana are higher than at any point in the past five years. This is of critical importance since the vaccines were supposed to significantly reduce deaths, but the opposite has happened. Hospitals are being flooded with vaccine complications and people in critical condition from medical neglect caused by the lockdowns and other pandemic measures.[46,56]

A dramatic number of these people are now dying, with the spike occurring after the vaccines were introduced. The lies flowing from those who have appointed themselves as medical dictators are endless. First, we were told that the lockdown would last only two weeks, they lasted over a year. Then we were told that masks were ineffective and did not need to be worn. Quickly that was reversed. Then we were told the cloth mask was very effective, now it’s not and everyone should be wearing an N95 mask and before that that they should double mask. We were told there was a severe shortage of respirators, then we discover they are sitting unused in warehouses and in city dumps, still in their packing crates. We were informed that the hospitals were filled mostly with the unvaccinated and later found the exact opposite was true the world over. We were told that the vaccine was 95% effective, only to learn that in fact the vaccines cause a progressive erosion of innate immunity.

Upon release of the vaccines, women were told the vaccines were safe during all states of pregnancy, only to find out no studies had been done on safety during pregnancy during the “safety tests” prior to release of the vaccine. We were told that careful testing on volunteers before the EUA approval for public use demonstrated extreme safety of the vaccines, only to learn that these unfortunate subjects were not followed, medical complications caused by the vaccines were not paid for and the media covered this all up.[67] We also learned that the pharmaceutical makers of the vaccines were told by the FDA that further animal testing was unnecessary (the general public would be the Guinea pigs.) Incredibly, we were told that the Pfizer’s new mRNA vaccines had been approved by the FDA, which was a cleaver deception, in that another vaccine had approval (comirnaty) and not the one being used, the BioNTech vaccine. The approved comirnaty vaccine was not available in the United States. The national media told the public that the Pfizer vaccine had been approved and was no longer classed as experimental, a blatant lie. These deadly lies continue. It is time to stop this insanity and bring these people to justice.

 

 

[Gordo]

On 9/24/2022 at 5:14 PM, Todd Allen said:

Hospitals are being flooded with vaccine complications and people in critical condition from medical neglect caused by the lockdowns and other pandemic measures.[46,56]

OK so I was silly enough to look up a couple of references and randomly picked the above, 56 led to "Nurse Dani" on a Rumble video from "Thrivetime Show: The ReAwakening versus The Great Reset" haha are you joking?? Reference 46 goes to LifeSiteNews, looks like they like the typical wing nut conspiracy  crap and not fact checking things: https://healthfeedback.org/outlet/lifesite-news/

Is this the best you can do?

[mccoy]

I see it in simpler terms.

Fascist-like measures have been adopted by those people (the Italian lefts+populists) who have been calling the opposition fascist.

The result, in Italy, has been the fall of the government who implemented the draconian measures and the ascent of the opposition of Giorgia Meloni, who gained +20% votes (she started from 6% to end up at 26%). With my utter satisfaction, Giorgia Meloni is going to be the prime minister in Italy and the extremists of the draconian measures are out.

I was among those who voted Giorgia Meloni and the main reason of my vote was because she fiercely opposed the mandatory vaccinations and the indiscriminate lockdowns. My feelings are evidently shared by another few million people in Italy.

[Todd Allen]

On 9/30/2022 at 7:43 AM, Gordo said:

OK so I was silly enough to look up a couple of references and randomly picked the above, 56 led to "Nurse Dani" on a Rumble video

I didn’t chase references for things which I have already seen significant evidence.  I agree it seems questionable to use as a reference a video of a presentation by a nurse.  But the statement being referenced wasn’t a topic of unsettled science but rather what is going on in hospitals.

Here are points raised by the nurse in the video:
* blocking attendance and visitation of family reduces patient advocacy
* covid status determined by PCR testing with high false positivity rate
* covid patients with sufficient respiratory function are given Versed aka midazolam (a pre-surgical sedative that suppresses breathing and causes short term amnesia) and put on ventilators
* covid patients given Remdesivir with severe kidney dysfunction side effects leading to fluid retention, pleural effusion and pulmonary edema
* patient's right to informed consent is ignored, explanation of the benefits and risks for these procedures is not given, no opportunity for patient questioning, requests for alternative treatments are not entertained
* standard presurgical procedure of covid PCR testing of asymptomatic people is blocking essential surgeries
* masking and social distancing is harming infants and children

Do you contest any of these points or do you find them irrelevent because the source is not an article published in a peer reviewed medical journal?

 

On 9/30/2022 at 7:43 AM, Gordo said:

Reference 46 goes to LifeSiteNews, looks like they like the typical wing nut conspiracy  crap and not fact checking things: https://healthfeedback.org/outlet/lifesite-news/

Your fact checker’s partners are among the worst of the worst including Facebook and Google: https://sciencefeedback.co/partners-funders-donors/
 

[BrianA]

We are running a long term trial in the US of how the death rates really work out for the pro-vax vs anti-vax individuals. Here are the current results:

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/covid-death-rates-higher-republicans-democrats-why-rcna50883

 

Covid death rates are higher among Republicans than Democrats, mounting evidence shows

Lower vaccination rates among Republicans could explain the partisan gap, but some researchers say mask use and social distancing were bigger factors.

[Saul]

Or maybe because red states are in poorer areas.

  --  Saul

[BrianA]

I believe this study was at the county level, not state level. So they compared counties in the same state. I'm sure there still is some economic difference, but the study mostly attributes the death rate differences to the vaccination statuses, because the effects only became detectable after the time that the vaccines became available. Before that, the differences didn't exist or were much less.

[Saul]

OK.  Sounds believable.

[Gordo]

On 10/7/2022 at 4:55 PM, BrianA said:

Covid death rates are higher among Republicans than Democrats, mounting evidence shows

Duh

[Ron Put]

On 10/7/2022 at 7:38 PM, Todd Allen said:

I didn’t chase references for things which I have already seen significant evidence.  I agree it seems questionable to use as a reference a video of a presentation by a nurse.  But the statement being referenced wasn’t a topic of unsettled science but rather what is going on in hospitals.

I kind of agree with Todd. Some of the references are wonky, but many are not. And frankly, much of the avalanche of politically-driven Covid papers that turned established epidemiological practices on their heads were as bad, or worse. Like the shouting through a funnel study used to support the U-turn on masks.

And in fairness, with the unprecedented censorship imposed by the Left, it was impossible to publish anything in a mainstream journal, and if one did, it was career-ending and the Twitter mobs would get it retracted in days.

But the main points remain valid, as Todd noted, at least IMO.

 

On 10/1/2022 at 6:53 PM, mccoy said:

Fascist-like measures have been adopted by those people (the Italian lefts+populists) who have been calling the opposition fascist.

There should be investigations of how this happened, and those who are proven to have knowingly implemented measures for political reasons (like Cuomo?) should face consequences. Not as retributions, but so it never happens again.

Italy led the wave of lockdowns, maybe it leads the way again.

[mccoy]

14 minutes ago, Ron Put said:

Italy led the wave of lockdowns, maybe it leads the way again.

Italy led the way but then absolutely parroted what the American CDC told, a government agency which seems to be managed by administrative personnel rather than practical specialists of virology .

If a decision is based on reasonable science it's all right, but in Italy it was based on mostly personal or political reasons (I can relate the details of the publicly broadcast conference held on January 6th 2022 by the premier and the minister of health. It was a total joke). 

14 minutes ago, Ron Put said:

maybe it leads the way again.

 I'm not sure I grasped the meaning of the above, best to ask before answering on a wrong assumption...

Edited October 9, 2022 by mccoy

[Ron Put]

And as platform censorship i slightly relaxing, we are starting to see some of the much needed discussion about the vaccines that were rushed through:
 

And while I don't necessarily agree with the call to suspend mRNA vaccines at this point (or with call for changing corporate standing), there really should be an open, and robust discussion about the technology, the approval process and any possible wrongdoing by the likes of Pfizer and the nature of their relationship with governments.
 

 

[Ron Put]

11 minutes ago, mccoy said:

 I'm not sure I grasped the meaning of the above, best to ask before answering on a wrong assumption...

I mean that if a major democracy opens a reasonably fair investigation of how all this happened, there will be pressure on other democracies to do so.

Italy was the first Western democracy to follow China's example, after Tedros called on Western governments to lock their populations down, because the virus is NOT easily transmissible like the flu, and therefore it can be contained by such measures.

After Italy, there was a domino effect, with the opposition in other democracies, mostly from the Left, joined by the media, going after leaders for "doing nothing" and demanding lockdowns. In the US, the Left was already apoplectic about Trump and started blaming him for every death, quickly proclaiming Cuomo and Newsom as the "true leaders" for locking up the population of their states and crashing the two of the largest economies in the world.

Then every democratically elected world politician fell in line, because who wants to be blamed for every uptick on the death ticketapes the mainstream media was running 24/7, driving the population into panic. Except in Sweden, which was relentlessly vilified.

And then they redefined what is a "Covid death," what is a pandemic, changed long-standing mask policies based on laughable evidence, imposed censorship and threatened the livelihood of experts who objected, mandated what were in effect experimental vaccines (including for children, who are not even at risk), and implemented vaccine passports to enter public spaces.

Yep, we do need a fair, proper and transparent investigation, because it will happen again if we don't do it.

[mccoy]

57 minutes ago, Ron Put said:

Yep, we do need a fair, proper and transparent investigation, because it will happen again if we don't do it.

AFAIK, there are no investigations under way in Italy for the facts you cited, except for a strategic pandemic emergency plan which was supposed to be in place before the pandemic but wasn't (which might have really avoided the lockdowns). Probably there won't be any, I hope I'm wrong.

I am satisfied that the lockdown governments crumbled down and that the former minister of health is out of duty and that the former opposition (strongly against the lockdowns and the exaggerations) led by Giorgia Meloni is now going to rule. The people of Italy apparently wanted to make sure that those things won't happen again at least in the short-medium term.

Edited October 9, 2022 by mccoy

[BrianA]

10 hours ago, Gordo said:

Duh

 

Believe it or not, the study did take ages into account. It binned the people into age buckets and compared apples-to-apples as far as I can tell.

[Todd Allen]

8 hours ago, Ron Put said:

Some of the references are wonky, but many are not.

For a bit more insight into the author of that article, Russell Blaylock, M.D., here's an interview with him and his partner on a new paper, James Lyons-Weiler, Ph.D., finding children who get the US childhood vaccine schedule have significantly more health issues than unvaccinated children, an update on the work of pediatrician Dr. Paul Thomas.

I'm sure many have already jumped to the conclusion they must be whack-a-doodle conspiracy nut jobs but my impression is these are credible accomplished men well worth the time to hear even if you disagree with their positions and findings.

https://live.childrenshealthdefense.org/shows/doctors-and-scientists-with-brian-hooker-phd/u4AE8T-eBq

At the bottom of the above linked video page are links to papers and a long detailed response to the paper I previously posted COVID UPDATE: What is the truth? all of which I found worthwhile.

[Ron Put]

6 hours ago, BrianA said:

Believe it or not, the study did take ages into account. It binned the people into age buckets and compared apples-to-apples as far as I can tell.

Can you point to how you can tell? A quick search finds the study, but I can't get access easily, and I have not seen anything about taking age into account.

A correlation may emerge for a variety of reasons, from age to socio-economic status and overall health status in specific areas. After all, a while back this paper from Germany claimed higher death rates in areas with higher vaccination areas. Of course, it got no headlines or discussion in the mainstream media, and it was censored. The only way one would have heard about it was from attacks on it -- it reminds me of the way we find out of contemporaneous criticism of early Christianity, through the works of Christian apologists attacking books burned long ago and thus forever lost to history.

Of course, regardless of the validity of the stats, the main point is that the state should not be allowed to mandate vaccination with what are in fact experimental and non-sterilizing vaccines, and coerce compliance.

And please stop calling those who disagree with you "anti-vaxers." People make choices for a variety of reasons, and if someone has reservations about a particular vaccine does not mean that they are against all vaccines. It's akin to the "newspeak" employed by all fascist/communist movements (it's why "liberal" has a different meaning in the US than in the rest of the world).
 

[Saul]

23 hours ago, Ron Put said:

there really should be an open, and robust discussion about the technology, the approval process and any possible wrongdoing by the likes of Pfizer and the nature of their relationship with governments.

What do you mean by "an open discussion"?  Do you mean videos put out on these forums?

IMO, virologists are more appropriate than prolific CR society posters.  And, of course, in a heated issue like the Covid-19 (former) pandemic, almost everyone, from the garbageman to the President, has opinions -- and you will be able to find a minority of virologists willing to espouse whatever opinion that you wish.

 

 

[Saul]

However, I should point out that I personally have been 100% against lockdowns, from the beginning.  E.g., I kept teaching courses at the University of Rochester in-person, whenever the UR Admin didn't insist on on-line teaching.  (So I was forced on-line for only one semester.)  OTOHH, I have been strongly pro-vax from the start:  I happily entered Phase III of the original Pfizer vaccine studies.

Concerning the mandates about vaccinating children:  IMO, it's ridiculous to claim that "there's more danger to children from vaccination than from infection".  The same argument can be made for pertussis and tetanus vaccines.  The vaccines help strengthen immunity to the respective diseases; while unvaccinated children are likely to do as well as (or maybe even slightly better) than vaccinated children in the short term, very definitely not so in the long term.