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Olive oil? Healthy or not?!


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On 2/27/2021 at 8:36 AM, tea said:

Is anyone able to access this newly published article?: Effects of bag-in-box packaging on long-term shelf life of extra virgin olive oil

I tried the usual sci-hub route, but for some reason I have no luck accessing the full text.  Curiously, all of the olive oils they tested showed very little drop in total phenolic content after as long as 24 months storage.

I've bought the recent Oilalà Coratina bag-in-box packages, they are excellent in preserving the taste and smell. Having a stab at the article

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From the researchgate link, figures can be expanded, The following graph is pretty eloquent and absolutely beyond expectations. It doesn't say the environment temperature, but EVOSS in BB  exhibited a small loss of total phenols, remaining practically unaried after 12 months. But also tin cans did not cause significant loss of total phenols after 12 months, whereas after 24 months the loss in tin cans is significant, remaining smallish in BB packages.

I'm curious to know about storage temperature and other details. This research would suggest that time elapsed after production is not a governing factor, especially in BB packages, where oxidation is kept in check. 

 

image.png.98ea6a543ffc513167ad2cb1fccc7536.png

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Conversely, the effect of oxidation is very evident in tin cans, we see a totally different behaviour in BB. From the preceding graph, oxidation doesn't seem to affect total phenol contents, whereas may affect oleacin and olecanthal and probably some molecules related to taste and smell.

 

image.png.b51900cd2fa49c851c81d3381ee819a3.png

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2 hours ago, mccoy said:

The following graph is pretty eloquent and absolutely beyond expectations.

Yeah, I was surprised too, when I saw it, although years ago I had seen research that boxed wine keeps a lot better than bottled wine. Of course, it never caught the public's fancy, because let's face it, it's a lot less impressive to squeeze a glass of wine out of a silver bag, than to uncork and pour from a bottle. I guess for the same reason screw-tops never caught, even though they are so much better than cork.

Amazon sells a few bagged olive oils, like this one.

I wonder if the bags are recyclable?

Edited by Ron Put
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  • 3 months later...

Dr. Gregor mentioned a new site True Health Initiative

In one of the articles there,  How Much Fat Should We Have in Our Diet?  the author states

My own lab has a paper in press showing acute improvement in endothelial function with genuine EVOO, and acute impairment with bargain-brand olive oil.

So the difference between high and low quality olive oil is not magnitude, but direction.

 

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37 minutes ago, Saul said:

Depends how much you trust Greger's "papers".  Dean does.

  --  Saul

To be clear, Greger isn't recommending olive oil in his latest video. He's pointing to a website run by other nutritionists who suggest that a diet of mostly whole plants is healthiest. One of those nutritionists seems to be suggesting based on his own laboratory research that genuine EVOO is good for arterial health, as Corybroo points out.

Regarding trusting Dr. Greger, I actually read the papers he points to make up my own mind. Sometimes he's on point, but sometimes he exaggerates the evidence, as I said here:

On 11/2/2015 at 1:59 PM, Dean Pomerleau said:

Dr. Greger does sometimes contorts the evidence to fit his strong bias in favor of a plant-based diet,

Here is an example of Dr. Greger's tendency to exaggerate:

Saul, I know from past experience that it is too much to ask that you actually read the information linked in a post before you comment on it, but if you had, you'd see that the author of the How Much Fat Should We Have in Our Diet? article that corybroo pointed to is really quite balanced and evidence-based. He basically says we don't know if a higher-fat plant-heavy diet with good quality EVOO is better, worse or the same as a low-fat, mostly plant diet. Here is his conclusion:

In the meantime, here’s what we do know: Whole-food, plant-predominant diets represent the theme of healthful eating. We know that whole-food, plant-exclusive diets are one of the variants on that theme that may or may not be better for human health than other entrants, but certainly are advantageous to our fellow-creatures, and the natural world at large. Parsing beyond that point [i.e. whether EVOO is good, bad or indifferent - DP] mostly leaves data behind.

--Dean

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  • 7 months later...

Hi all,

Any comments on how much EVOO is too much?

I have had consumed EVOO changing from 0 up to 160-180 grams daily.

At the time I had been consuming a lot, it was that addictive that I even couldn’t stop the rise. Now it’s okay tho. 

—Muhammet

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2 hours ago, mgoktas20 said:

Any comments on how much EVOO is too much?

I don't think there is an upper limit, as far as you don't go too much high with total calories (from other sources).

The quantities you cite are typical of anti-cholesterol keto diets with little or no animal fats.

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On 2/20/2022 at 11:45 PM, mccoy said:

I don't think there is an upper limit, as far as you don't go too much high with total calories (from other sources).

The quantities you cite are typical of anti-cholesterol keto diets with little or no animal fats.

Well, that might be true because my HDL and LDL are respectively 50 and 63.

I hope to adjust the amount depending on my blood parameters. I just got one in 2 years.

I will increase or decrease or keep it steady.

—Muhammet

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hmmm……https://doi.org/10.1093/ajcn/nqab287

shocking high fat diet significantly lowers cardio and diabetic risk factors when compared to higher healthy whole carb diets, although the high carb group ate some jam and sweetened yogurts.The three groups ate either a 20%, 40% or a 60% fat diet. All groups ate 20% protein and all groups avoided processed carbs. 
 

The study was about as good as it gets for controlling what people ate; but it was a younger healthy group.

Edited by Mike41
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1 hour ago, Mike41 said:

Hmmm……https://doi.org/10.1093/ajcn/nqab287

The study was about as good as it gets for controlling what people ate; but it was a younger healthy group.

Just glancing at the sample menus, it's not exactly surprising. They were eating stuff like English muffins, strawberry fruit spread, and added sugar Greek yogurt in the higher carb groups, and trading those calories for olive oil and macadamia nuts, AND added 200+ grams of salad in the low carb group.

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A bit of good new, bad news

Oleic acid, a key to activating the brain's 'fountain of youth'

oleic acid produced in the brain is an essential regulator of the process that enables learning and memory and supports proper mood regulation

discovered that a common fatty acid called oleic acid binds to TLX and this increases cell proliferation and neurogenesis in the hippocampus of both young and old mice

While oleic acid is also the major component in olive oil, however, this would not be an effective source of oleic acid because it would likely not reach the brain, the researchers explained. It must be produced by the cells themselves.  [Emphasis added]

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On 3/22/2022 at 12:02 AM, tea said:

Just glancing at the sample menus, it's not exactly surprising. They were eating stuff like English muffins, strawberry fruit spread, and added sugar Greek yogurt in the higher carb groups, and trading those calories for olive oil and macadamia nuts, AND added 200+ grams of salad in the low carb group.

Yep, it matters what alternative you compare it with. It's crazy that these studies are actually published.

Like this absolute nonsense from Harvard, which generated numerous headlines touting the "confirmed" mortality-lowering benefits of olive oil. But then you read closer and find that:

"In substitution analyses, replacing 10 g/d of margarine, butter, mayonnaise, and dairy fat with the equivalent amount of olive oil was associated with 8%-34% lower risk of total and cause-specific mortality. No significant associations were observed when olive oil was compared with other vegetable oils combined."

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  • 1 month later...

Any thoughts on sourcing an olive oil rich in DMB? DMB seems to be a promising molecule for reducing TMAO and inflammation.

Not sure how much truth there is, but this article claims:
“You don’t want most extra-virgin olive oil from Italy, because it doesn’t have much DMB in it,” he says. Instead, opt for oil from Turkey, Spain, Greece, or California. Other DMB-rich foods include balsamic vinegar, watermelon, and red wine."

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I am reluctant to give up the Coratina oil I usually purchase unless it is clearly shown that the benefits provided by BMD are greater than the benefits provided by a high concentration of secoiridoids and tocopherols. How many studies or trials do we have on BMD?

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I have osteoporosis, and it has been slowly improving through my use of the drug Forteo (terraparitide), for quite a few years.  By injecting a dose once daily (or even once weekly), Forteo builds and strengthens bone.  It really works.  (But it's hard to get approval from Insurance -- it's very expensive.)

  --  Saul

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  • 3 months later...

https://www.jacc.org/doi/abs/10.1016/j.jacc.2021.10.041

Higher olive oil intake was associated with lower risk of total and cause-specific mortality. Replacing margarine, butter, mayonnaise, and dairy fat with olive oil was associated with lower risk of mortality
 

observational, but about as good as these types of research get. Still doesn’t prove cause and effect.

still a comparison of fats, not low fat vs olive oil. 

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20 hours ago, Mike41 said:

observational, but about as good as these types of research get. Still doesn’t prove cause and effect.

still a comparison of fats, not low fat vs olive oil. 

And while based on what I have read I now do believe that lower fat is better, see my comment in bold in the post above:

 

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8 hours ago, Ron Put said:

And while based on what I have read I now do believe that lower fat is better, see my comment in bold in the post above:

 

Exactly, research is very limited. The little bit we have of heart patients indicates very positive effects from very low fat diets. Even reversing heart disease. These were done by Ornish and Esseltyne. Olive oil is always compared to butter, margarine etc. not good enough imo

Edited by Mike41
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